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Updated: RingPlus Says Their Crazy New Terms of Service Are Nothing to Worry About

RingPlus Terms and Conditions
Two days ago, freemium Sprint MVNO RingPlus quietly modified its Terms and Conditions page increasing the number of "General Rules" from 11 to 24. The changes were not announced and the "MODIFIED AS OF JULY 13, 2016" header at the top of the page was not updated until today suggesting they were hoping no one would notice the change. You can see the old, pre September 6 rules in the Google cache here.

Most of the new rules are reasonable. There's now a rule against attempting to hack the RingPlus system and another prohibiting using a talk, text and data plan solely for data. However two of the new rules, 20 and 22, are so restrictive that the majority of RingPlus customers are probably already in violation of them and the ones that aren't will be soon.

Rule 20 states; "If your talk, text or data usage exceeds 50% of your total voice, text or data usage for any prior billing cycle in the immediately prior 6 months, RingPlus may, in its sole discretion and without notice, expire, suspend, terminate or downgrade your Service."

In other words you can not use more than half as many minutes, texts or units of data in the current month as as you used in the month in the last six when you used the least.

For example: If your lowest usage month in the last six months was 100 minutes, 100 texts and 100 MB of data, in the current month you can only use 50 minutes, 50 texts and 50 MB. That becomes you new lowest month so next month you can only use 25 minutes, texts and MB. Every month going forward your allowance is cut in half. Sooner or later, every RingPlus user will violate that rule that rule unless they don't use their phone at all, and that would put free plan users in violation of rule 10: "If you do not make calls using your Free Plan for 60 days, RingPlus may, in its sole discretion and without notice, expire, suspend, terminate or downgrade your Service."

Rule 22 is just as crazy: "If your talk, text or data usage exceeds the average use of talk, text or data by all RingPlus Members, RingPlus may, in its sole discretion and without notice, expire, suspend, terminate or downgrade your Service." Half of all users will always be using more than the average. If RingPlus terminates the over-average half, then half the remaining users will be using more than the new average and subject to termination. You can see where that's going.

The new rules caused a bit of an uproar on RingPlus' in-house user forum. A thread discussing the new terms currently has over 200 comments, almost all of then negative. Many of comments fear that RingPlus is shutting down and needs the new terms to make it easier to do so without refunding customer balances.

It doesn't help the mood on the RingPlus forum that no RingPlus employee has responded to the complaints and questions there. However, RingPlus CTO Even McGee (startledmarmot) did respond to the TOS controversy on a HowardForums thread saying

"...There's no grand conspiracy here, the company is not going out of business, everything is literally exactly the same as it was last week. These new rules were put into place primarily so that RingPlus can, at its discretion, remove users that are fraudulently abusing the system.

As you can easily imagine, being a free telecom service, we're besieged with such activity. It takes quite a few resources in both engineering time and Support time to isolate them only to have our ToS thrown back in our face, claiming that what they were doing "isn't technically against the letter of the ToS."

Naturally, we can't exactly say "Stop doing X, Y, Z" because then they would know how to avoid our internal flags and triggers..."

According to startledmarmot, the new terms are just to make it easier to kick abusive users off the system and won't be used against users who don't abuse the system. The problem I have with startledmarmot's explanation is that is how are users supposed to know what constitutes abuse if it isn't defined in the terms? If you don't want users doing "X, Y, Z", add rules prohibiting X, Y and Z. If users stop doing those things, even if it's only to avoid "internal flags and triggers", RingPlus will have accomplished their goal of eliminating X, Y, and Z.

By setting up nonsensical rules to make it easier to kick off users guilty of unspecified abuse, RingPlus is no better than TracFone was when it advertised "Unlimited" data and then kicked off customers who used "too much" data while refusing to say how much was too much. That behavior earned TracFone a $40 million FCC fine.

Although RingPlus' most popular plans are "free" in that they have no recurring monthly cost, they due require an initial to-up of up to $38. I suspect that most of RingPlus' revenue comes from these initial top-ups. The new Terms and Conditions seem to be having a very negative effect on customer confidence in RingPlus' future. That lack of confidence will likely lead to fewer new activations and less revenue for RingPlus. If RingPlus wants to keep signing up new users they need to amend their terms be be transparent about what constitutes abuse rather than with impossible to follow rules that make everyone a TOS violator.

Update 10-Sep-2016: RingPlus has changed their Terms of Service again. The changes are for the better but there are still some issues. Here are Rules 20 and 22 with deletions indicated by strikeout and additions by bold:

20) If your talk, text or data usage exceeds 50% of your total voice, text or data usage for any prior billing cycle in the immediately prior 6 months by 50%, RingPlus may, in its sole discretion and without with notice, expire, suspend, terminate or downgrade your Service. You may appeal such decisions to the Ethical Committee in the RingPlus Social forum at https://social.ringplus.net. In cases involving expiration of accounts, you will be given 7 days to port-out to preserve your phone number.

22) If your talk, text or data usage exceeds the average use of talk, text or data by all RingPlus Members, RingPlus may, in its sole discretion and without notice, expire, suspend, terminate or downgrade your Service. You may appeal such decisions to the Ethical Committee in the RingPlus Social forum at https://social.ringplus.net. In cases involving expiration of accounts, you will be given 7 days to port-out to preserve your phone number.

Both rules now have a provision for appealing penalties for violating them and give customers whese service is terminated 7 days to port out their numbers.

The change to rule 20 means that your usage has to be more than 150% (instead of 50%) of your lowest monthly usage in the previous six months. That's might make sense for "unlimited" plans, which almost always have a hidden cap, but it's still unreasonable for plans which come with a published amount of minutes, texts and data included. It a plan says it includes 1000 MB it's unreasonable to punish a customer who uses 500 MB one month and 800 MB the next.

Apparently rules 20 and 22 are intended to apply to new unlimited plans that RingPlus plans to launch soon. In a post on RingPlus in-house forum, RingPlus CEO Karl Seelig writes that "...Of course, the new rules 20 and 22 are not intended for Members on current plans; we have edited those terms to ease concerns (see below). Those rules were put in for future plan offerings yet to come. We are very fast approaching our end goal of “totally free cell service for all Members” and we had to prepare legal terms for future upcoming plan offerings. You will see so-called “unlimited” free and paid plans probably as early as Christmas..."

The only problem I have with Seelig's statement is that if rules 20 and 22 don't apply to current plans or non-unlimited plans, I would expect it to say so right in the Terms of Service. Does a written statement by a company's CEO on a publicly accessible website  overrule the company's published Terms of Service? I'm not an attorney and I don't pretend to know the answer but I would feel a lot more comfortable if the Terms spelled out which plans rules 20 and 22 apply to.

Update 12-Sep-2016: RingPlus has completely re-written rules 22 and 23 that to make it clear that those two rules only apply to unlimited plans and plan add-ons first offered after 13-Sept-2016: Here's the latest iteration of those two controversial rules:

20.This rule does not apply to plans featuring set allotments of data (e.g. 3GB), or any plan or Add On (i.e., an allotment of minutes, SMS, MMS or data offered separately from a plan) first offered on or before 9/13/16. This rule applies to plans featuring unlimited minutes, unlimited SMS, unlimited MMS and unlimited data, and Add Ons offered after 9/13/16 in order to prevent Abuse and to protect the RingPlus community as a whole. “Abuse” includes failure to abide by RingPlus Legal Notices, the terms of your plan, fraud, attempted fraud, defrauding RingPlus, attempting to defraud RingPlus, or engaging in (or attempting to engage in) conduct which financially, technologically or legally harms RingPlus. If your use of minutes, SMS, MMS or data in any current billing cycle exceeds your use of minutes, SMS, MMS or data (i.e., a comparison of like units such as SMS, etc.) for any prior billing cycle in the immediately prior 6 months by more than 50%, RingPlus may examine your usage of your plan as such deviations in usage patterns may indicate that there may be an issue that needs to be investigated by RingPlus. If RingPlus does not find Abuse, RingPlus will take no action. If RingPlus finds Abuse, it may in its discretion and with notice suspend, downgrade, or terminate your Service. You may appeal such decisions to the Ethical Committee in the RingPlus Social forum at https://social.ringplus.net, and RingPlus will respect the ruling of the Ethical Committee. In cases involving termination of accounts, you will be given seven (7) days to initiate a port-out to preserve your phone number (we understand it may take more time to actually complete). RingPlus had added this rule in order to be open with you to make you aware that we will monitor the system for Abuse of such plans in order to protect the community.

22. This rule does not apply to plans featuring set allotments of data (e.g. 3GB), or any plan or Add On (i.e., an allotment of minutes, SMS, MMS or data offered separately from a plan) first offered on or before 9/13/16. This rule applies to plans featuring unlimited minutes, unlimited SMS, unlimited MMS and unlimited data, and Add Ons offered after 9/13/16 in order to prevent Abuse (defined in General Rule 20, above) and to protect the RingPlus community as a whole. If your use of minutes, SMS, MMS or data in any current billing cycle exceeds the average use of minutes, SMS, MMS or data (i.e., a comparison of like units such as SMS, etc.) by all RingPlus Members on the same plan by more than 50%, RingPlus may examine your usage of your plan as such deviations in usage patterns may indicate that there may be an issue that needs to be investigated by RingPlus. If RingPlus does not find Abuse, RingPlus will take no action. If RingPlus finds Abuse, it may in its discretion and with notice suspend, downgrade, or terminate your Service. You may appeal such decisions to the Ethical Committee in the RingPlus Social forum at https://social.ringplus.net, and RingPlus will respect the ruling of the Ethical Committee. In cases involving termination of accounts, you will be given seven (7) days to initiate a port-out to preserve your phone number (we understand it may take more time to actually complete). RingPlus had added this rule in order to be open with you to make you aware that we will monitor the system for Abuse of such plans in order to protect the community.

These latest changes satisfy me that the rules 20 and 22 do not apply to non-unlimited plans or any plan offered before today.

160 comments:

Comment Page :
  1. Looks like the nay sayers were right all along!
    This company is becoming a bigger joke by the day..or should I say by the plan!

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    1. With carrier own brands like Cricket, MetroPCS, and Boost Mobile offerings, there is honestly no reason to put up with the shenanigans of Ring Plus. It would appear that free just isn't worth it with RP.

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    2. Anybody tweet T-Mobile or one of the other competitors with the responses from this thread? I would, but after hearing what happens to those who do, it's not yet worth losing my family's lines with them. Once it hits the fan, different story.

      Delete
  2. i have a 4 gb data free plan, and i talk only 200 minutes a month and i don't text at all. So as per their rule to keep my line alive i should talk and text at least 2000 minutes. which means i need to talk at least 60 minutes a day ( 1 hour) . what a joke ....

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  3. So this is retroactive to plans created before September 6th as well, right? Thanks ringplus for being shady now that you have my money and family members phone numbers :/

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  4. Currently the RP forum has more than 10 pages (mostly negative) with over 5000 views, more views than any other thread ever on the forum and yet NO RESPONSE from anyone at RP. The CTO did respond on another forum and said he doesn't understand all the "vitriol" Now that's a terrific response when you have 50% + of your membership PO'd.

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    1. Up to 15 pages and about to hit 16 (374 replies and 10.96K views). For them, it's only going to get worse as many of their diehard fans have stopped recommending RP.

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  5. Ringplus is a joke. This is a beginning of the end. I told you people that Ringplus won't stay in business for long if you giving out free plan. Your main source is getting from up and new sign up. Sooner or later that going to dry up and plans will be cancel. Words of cancel don't sign up for any more Ringplus plans.

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    1. It's doable although they are showing the wrong way to do it. They generate revenue from the ads played during calls on the non-Mad plans and on ads played during data usage. Long-term this can more than offset RP's cost of the free plans. They also generate money from the various paid plans which are still below what you pay for the competition.

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  6. Hm . . . interesting development. I have put in more money than I had hope because of their upgrades. But my usage is increasing. It does make sense that a few abusers do force them to revise their terms. Hopefully, that is all. And they do not cut off the "average" user. Once they do that, there will be an exodus.

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    1. seems like that was the business plan to generate revenue. Glad I didn't get caught up in that and personally, stuck with the first plan I started with and never paid any additional top-ups, stuck with a simple modest plan which fit my needs just fine, and didn't hord more than I needed.

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    2. Easy for them to blame abusers when the new rules abuse customers. You can't offer unlimited and then accuse somebody of abusing the plan. Don't call it unlimited if it's not. Karl claims it only targets unlimited plans, but you can't target an unlimited plan for abuse unless you aren't offering an unlimited plan. Plus, his guru used a limited plan as an example. If I want to use 100 GB on an unlimited plan, then I should be able to and not get accused of gaming the system or abusing it. When I had a throttled plan on RingPlus, I rarely came close to hitting the maximum for unthrottled. The joys of access to real Internet at home and on the go. Want to kill the abuse? Stop offering "unlimited" when you are not and limit how much data you allow. Already had somebody want me to sign up for the lawsuit, but I declined for now. Maybe once it's becomes class action and I can get my certificate for auto top up, I might change my mind. Going to refer them to the law firm I used in my last class action.

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  7. This is nuts.

    If I have a plan of 500 minutes, texts, and mb, it is impossible to call any use of any of these three, in any combination , from 0-500, "abuse".

    I'm just glad I let RP choose a throwaway random phone number, and did not port my number, and have treated them as a curiosity and not a real carrier.

    I feel sorry for those who mistook RP for a legitimate, responsible company and trusted them to be their daily driver.

    Their "catch 22" TOS is for the birds.

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  8. When free is starting to seem more costly than its worth...

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  9. It's funny how the fanboy/shills are conveniently absent today.

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    1. I was getting to like it. But with their TOS now directly contradicting their clearly advertised deals, they now look evil.

      Evil!

      Delete
  10. You know what they say...if it looks like a duck...well, you know the rest...

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  11. I recommend hyphenating "Impossible to Follow" in title. It's otherwise confusing, especially for someone who doesn't immediately recognize that "Its" can only have the possessive meaning.

    Let's hope that Rule #20 was written wrong in at least more than one way so that the maximum non-violating monthly usage doesn't spiral down like how you outline.

    Even so, I don't see how it could be grammatically revised in a way that does not make it an explicit violation to have significantly more usage in one month than prior months. And how would this criteria signal abuse any more effectively than the minimum 1 call every 60 days? Are they encouraging me to wastefully use airtime at the end of months I haven't otherwise used many minutes?

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  12. I just read the new TOS for myself after reading the Howard Forums thread and taking a look at the RingPlus forum. I may or may not be correct in thinking this is a way of telling those of us who played by the rules (in my case, one line as I'm one person, used for outgoing voice calls regularly, not used primarily for data) that it's time to move on. If they want to tell some of us that our free plans are up and it's time to switch to a currently-available paid offering or port out, they could just say so.

    Nonetheless, even if my line or the entire company ended tomorrow, I feel I received my money's worth over the last 10 months.

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    1. Same here... Time to skedaddle.

      Stick a fork in Ringplus... It's time to leave.

      Call it their "Tine to Go" plan.

      Delete
    2. I know, put some money in as top-up, get 1-2 month free service and you've broken even already. Use it longer and you are saving, these guys claiming ponzi are the reason legalizing weed was a bad idea. :-p

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    3. Thought I'd update that I kept my RingPlus line, and currently using it while moving and temporarily without home internet service (browser only, with images shut off). Lots of voice calls to places to update addresses and such. Will post an update if I'm warned or terminated for using my voice/data buckets.

      Also, according to Opensignal and Sensorly, Sprint Network has the second-best signal behind AT&T at this location; it pays to check into this stuff.

      Delete
  13. This company is scam and big ripoff...

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  14. Great writing, Dennis B.

    Everyone else ... Port out of RingPlus ASAP!

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  15. reading the angry chaos in the ringplus social forum is like the bad old awful DLex discourse forum days have returned but intensely multiplied 10X.

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    1. Hardly. DLex was replaced by the likes of Chelle, HHfpphone, AKALtd Jamielei and others. DLex was at least honest, these other frauds are just boot lickers of Karl.

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    2. What's funny is those people listed above will be some of the people that you will review your dismissal if you dispute your service being cancelled, what do you think the outcome will be?

      I heard they pay some of the volunteer members pretty well with benefits, they are not going against the grain for fear that they will loose those precious bennies.

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    3. Posted by a mod in the rp forum:
      "hhfpphonehhfpphone Ethical Committee
      Oh no, could all the mods and EC be really 1 person?!? "

      I doubt 1 person but they sure do all act the same. Hard to believe their is that much kool-aid available to keep them in fanboy mode.

      Delete
    4. Wow, what benefits? The plans are free already. Do you mean the Club Houses give them free sandwiches?

      Delete
    5. Posted by a mod in the rp forum:
      "hhfpphonehhfpphone Ethical Committee
      Oh no, could all the mods and EC be really 1 person?!? "

      I doubt 1 person but they sure do all act the same. Hard to believe their is that much kool-aid available to keep them in fanboy mode.

      Do you think maybe they're really advanced Bots? Seems like they are online all hours of the day. Amazing!

      Delete
    6. Maybe bots but some are pretty rude to just be a bot. I see them on a regular basis call people trolls and other names if they don't like what they see posted. Bots, shills, fanboys whatever this slime is called are parasites of the worst kind.

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    7. Wasn't Weren't the Microsoft and Google AI bots racist?!? Would not be surprised if RingPlus bots are rude.

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    8. Easy to program rude. My favorite PC game is full of rude programming.

      Delete
  16. I've used RingPlus for a little over a year. During that year, at least every couple of months there is an outbreak of fear and certainty that the end is nigh.
    It hasn't happened yet. It could happen tomorrow, or it could never happen. In the meantime, I'm still enjoying saving money, and expecting this to turn into another "much ado about nothing".
    If you're with any alternative MVNO, it's always wise to have an exit strategy in mind: the longevity of MVNOs isn't great.

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    1. Several MVNOs have been around for a long time are are in no danger of going around. RP is acting like Wal-Mart and that only works for a company large enough to do customer service as poorly as AT&T, Verizon, et al.

      Delete
  17. I agree with this (reposted here):

    link:
    http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php/1887184-Ring-Plus-s-New-Draconian-usage-rules?p=16718087#post16718087



    I don't want to go as far as calling RP a "ponzi scheme", but one does wonder if the entire business plan revolves solely around:

    1. Create ridiculously attractive paid or free plans to get new users onboard..

    2. Offer new plans frequently that are just attractive enough to get people to switch to them (lots of variety employed to capture many people's usage and payment ideals...)

    3. On each plan change have a required Top-Up of what has now become $30+ usually

    4. Then implement rules so that the top-ups can't be used for any monthly service payments (I saw they just did that. Credit Cards are all that's accepted for payment, even if you have sufficient TopUp balance to cover the costs) and thus Top Up payments will largely be retained, save for the occasional people using some roaming or some extra data here and there.

    Note on this one: If you are a normal user, the charge just to enable Roaming (just to enable it!) is $50 minimum TopUp Balance...but again, remember, you can't use the TopUp to pay for any service fees - only for extras.. This nets out as money gone forever for many many users I'd imagine...

    5. Hopefully people leave on their own after trying and not being 100% satisfied over time, RP keeps all fees collected as barely useable TopUp charges and new customers come in at the start of the chain

    6. Rinse, repeat.

    7. Finally...as they just did...create some new Terms of Service to get rid of people as needed who don't follow Step #5 as anticipated.

    Sure feels like that's largely the plan (or at least a large part of it)

    My counter argument to this would be bad word of mouth...but it does always amaze me how ridiculously low prices will get people to overlook acres and acres of things in life. I'd bet many new people say "it's so cheap..if I don't like it I'll just leave/dump the extra line", not realizing they are starting down the chain at step one and will be parting with some money shortly for the upcoming "amaze-balls offer" due out in the next week or two..

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    1. Bad word of mouth these days is worth a lot more than companies seem to get. Going viral can damage a company more than any short gains they think they might get. Ask a major fastfood company if anybody doubts.

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  18. There is no way to determine what is considered abuse, all you can go by are the legally binding terms of service posted and they are written in such a way that you almost can not violate either 20 or 22. You won't know until you find your account expired, suspended, terminated or downgraded. Not even a warning saying you are violating the TOS and take notice.
    Their refusal to comment on their own Forum is just confirmation that these new rues are in fact set in motion and will be applied as they see fit.

    These are binding legal terms and can only be taken as such, you can't read anything into them other than what they actually specify. So why should anyone find any comfort in the CTO telling customers that they have nothing to worry about? I wonder what their Jerry_GC Mowrey Lawyer has to say about these legal terms being only binding to some and not to others?
    What a Fraud!

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    1. Don't know, don't care. If they had a lawyer read them, they should know why it's beyond bad. If the lawyer isn't versed in governmentese, they need somebody who is.

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  19. How I'm supposed to abuse a plan that have specific limited caps for voice/text/data and any overages are immediately charged against my balance?? OTOH, am I supposed to use most of it even if I don't want it?

    I'm an almost data only user so I don't get to hear much their ads and I recognize that may not makem them happy. They could impose a minimum number on completed calls per period. I'd happily oblige.

    Anyway. This is dumb. Glad this is a just a throw-away number for me.

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    1. Better yet, how can one abuse an unlimited plan? By definition, per the FCC and FTC, unlimited means unlimited unless a company makes it clear in a plan's description that unlimited is throttled, has an actual limit, etc. So far, RingPlus has done none of these things and from what they plan to change it to, it still won't.

      Filed my first FCC complaint as their new Double/Cut plan is "unlimited" but subject to rules 20 and 22. Don't know why they believe they can get around what happened to TracFone not too long ago when they offered unlimited that wasn't unlimited. Simple rule, don't offer unlimited if you are not willing to let people have it. It's not abuse if they claim unlimited and you use as much as you want. It is abuse when they claim unlimited, but slap you down for exceeding some unknown maximum. I rarely need RingPlus data as the places I am most of the day have free Wi-Fi or I'm in a situation where I am not using Wi-Fi for various reasons.

      Looking to join the class action to prove to RingPlus rule 24 isn't enforceable. Will only get a $15-20 credit, but more importantly, it sends a message to RingPlus.

      Delete
    2. AT&T text cramming class action lawsuit (I did not sign up for it but got a check) only got me like 75 cents. If you think a class action will get you anywhere over a dollar, you are dreaming.

      Delete
    3. You can get over a dollar, but it depends on the violator's violations. You probably won't get more than $75 and closer to $20 and it may be in the form of a credit "top up" with the company as opposed to real spendable $. In addition, the first filer often gets a lot more than some cheesy credit. Some of them make $10 - 20K. Plus, if a person brings it to the attention of the law firm who files the class action, they can get a finder's fee. I have a feeling anybody who joins in the class action will fall victim to RingPlus tactic of account closing. For me, it's about RingPlus not breaking the law with this stupid fake "unlimited" nonsense. T-Mobile has unlimited, but makes it clear if you exceed 26 GB, you are toast. Kent needs to do the same because putting some vague crap won't cut it. His lawyer may love it, but the feds and courts will show him why it was a bad idea.

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  20. Are they just math impaired or what? Logic fail. Exceeds 50 percent of any of the previous 6 months? ANY? How is that supposed to be the normal usage pattern they seem to want. This is Xeno's paradox, as you halve your usage each month until it reaches 1 minute and you can't use the phone anymore as a phone. Buh bye in 6 months or is it 7, I'm always off by one.

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  21. Title needs work - it's clunky and confusing. Check with your editor.

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    1. I changed the title a little, I think it's clearer now. Thanks for your suggestion.

      Delete
  22. I have given them more business than I planned to as well. I have even paid for upgrades and new lines after I said I wasn't giving them any more money. I was even considering porting my sainted mother into this benighted terror of a MVNO but thankfully I have seen the error of my ways and come to my senses in time.

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  23. Can those of us with top up fund balances get refunds or at least dispute the charges with our credit card company?

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    1. If you go the chargeback route, be sure you don't care about your phone number.

      I'm sure they'll cancel your account and your phone # will be gone forever if a chargeback goes through.

      Delete
  24. The CEO didn't bother to respond to any of the TOS concerns...but did have time to post a "new Promo!" just now.

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    1. What are the odds that one will SELL OUT?

      Delete
  25. You guys all make good points but you missed an obvious one. If your plan (free or paid) advertises, for example, 500 min/text/MB and your service is cancelled for using more than 250 minutes, texts or MB of data then it's false advertising. If your plan provides for 500 units of usage per month, using more than half of that isn't abuse. Any rule that says you can't use what's included in your plan is going to get them in trouble. I suspect that rule 20 and 22 are aimed at users of their new unlimited talk and text plans that start at only $4/mo but it's still false advertising. Rule 22 might also be used to cut the number of customers on free plans. Either way, they are going to get sued.

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    1. They should get sued - Maybe that would get them to actually respect their customers and respond to concerns.

      Shameful the way they are (not) handling this.

      Delete
    2. You are one of the few who gets this. I suspect RP thinks Rule 24 will prevent lawsuits, but after seeing too many companies with similar rules get sued, they are living in a fantasy world. Throw the FCC busting them for going after people on unlimited plans and doing so without making it across the board, the DOJ will join in.

      Delete
    3. But Rule 20 applies only on Unlimited plan as it says ("This rule applies to plans featuring unlimited minutes, unlimited SMS, unlimited MMS and unlimited data, and Add Ons ") You example of 500 min/text/MB does not apply here. This rule is not for limited plans

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  26. They're gonna take everyone's money and run, just like Tracfone's customer service steals your balances, gives you the run around for days and then tells you to top up again because there's nothing they can do.

    Bonus points when the latter admits they don't know your balances, then uses lies, fuzzy math or more excuses to avoid crediting your account because they, who lost your allotments and won't give them back, think YOU'RE untrustworthy.

    At the end of the day, it's all according to scam.

    You just have to steer clear of these fraudsters, lest you find out that your $100 top up which you even have a screenshot of "never really existed" as far as they're concerned.

    After all, those types of MVNOs are why postpaid will never go out of style.

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  27. I don't think they are eligible to be sued. Seems all legal. They aren't idiotic enough to put themselves on the sue market. I bet they scoped it all out long before imposing the new changes. There.

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    1. "Terms" exist to make shady outfits sue-proof, even when it's clear they're acting in bad faith.

      All you can do is pack your wallet and leave.

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    2. Famous last words. Even lawyers are error prone and you can bet there will be investigations into this.

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    3. You are dreaming if you think RP can't be sued. General Rule 24 may exist, but lawyers have been able to sue, and class action, companies with a binding arbitration clause. Using phrases about company's discretion guarantee a lawsuit unless they apply the terms to all.

      Delete
  28. Remember when AT&T was setting "abuse" guideline for their DSL and Uverse? At least they post the limit and actual have webpage you can track (this can after and only shows if you have significant usage). R+ does not even have this. How can anyone predict what their month to month usage would be? If one can, he/she might just sign up for Ting type service where you can pick your limits rather than risk getting line cut.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Ting costs a massive amount more and is on the same poor network. Might as well pay a little more and get something good at that point.

      Delete
    2. RingPlus dashboard shows your usage. Data may be 3 - 6 hours behind, but it's good otherwise.

      Delete
  29. Abusive users could be 1 person with 30 lines swapping a phone for each day of the month... replacing their home broadband with free cell service. It would be AWESOME if RingPlus can identify and kick out these folks because it just means more data for the rest of us regular folks.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. You have a good point. I'm a user with one line who actually listens to the voice ads, and uses less talk, minutes , and data than the plan I have advertises.

      These TOS have identified me as the enemy.

      Delete
    2. "it just means more data for the rest of us regular folks"

      That's not how it works.

      Delete
    3. Data isn't a set amount so there's not more for the rest of us. The cost to having 30 phones would be more than it's worth between having to keep them all charged, initial top-up fees, etc. Cost of getting the phones, even using EBay, Swappa, etc. Not saying some haven't done this, but there are cheaper ways to achieve the same goal.

      Delete
    4. Thirty phones? I thought the claims of 10 - 20 were outlandish. The cost to Top-up 10 lines would be pretty high, excluding the cost of cheap LTE phones found EBay, Swappa, etc. Add the cost of constantly recharging them and you are losing more money than 5 GB/line (if you grabbed one of the 5 GB plans) x 10, 20, or 30 is worth. One would need to use each phone daily instead of swapping daily as that would trigger alerts at RingPlus. Plus, you would need 3 accounts because each account is limited to 10 lines if you went with 30; 2 accounts for 11-20 lines. The cost in time would far exceed the value of 50 - 150 GB of data/30 days. I don't use much data on RingPlus as 90% of my time is around Wi-Fi - paid at home, free almost everywhere else I go. Maybe 5% driving when I don't use my phone at all for anything and another 5% where I am at one of a handful of places without free Wi-Fi.
      Their latest clarifications don't jive. One says new unlimited only and others say new plans. Unlimited is a stupid concept from a legal standpoint unless you are willing to stand by and stupid from a business standpoint because 5-10% or more of your customers will use it at very high levels. Find it funny when they talk about the average user only does 2.5 GB/month. That's across the board and needs to be broken up into different categories. If I have 6 GB with a company and another person has 1 GB or less, they are less likely to hit anywhere near what I can.

      Delete
  30. you can't get blood out of a stone.
    In case to-ups and upgrade money all got spent,
    you can sue as much as you want,
    it would only cost you money.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. On contraire, most lawyers in these cases go for contingency fees and only get a percentage - sometimes a hefty percentage of what you win. You don't win, you don't owe.

      Delete
    2. Right, and these commentors must be from competing companies. A RingPlus customer would not want the company to go down, as these commenters seem to excited about, because then we would be forced back to the open arms of paid cell service and be back on having to pay a monthly cell phone bill... I, for one, do not look forward to paying $200 a month for the whole family to get cell service.

      Delete
  31. a couple of the moderators are deleting posts on discourse Jamielei and hhfpphone the shills of rp don't want to see any more complaining I guess they better start with FW, SD, HOFO and others forums as well because they all have 100's of complaints and still no answer from anyone running the show, what does that tell you

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. hhfphone said he/she has 7 lines now thats abuse if you ask me but they still allow this a** to be a mod.

      Delete
    2. You are allowed a separate free line for each physical person, plus as many paid lines as you want.

      Delete
    3. Justify the cheating all you want. Maybe the dog even has his own phone. It's this sort of stealing that got R+ management to this point to begin with.

      Delete
    4. "Justify the cheating all you want"

      I have only one line. I intentionally listen to the voice-call ads. I use all three of text, voice, and data, but always less than for the plan I paid for.

      Yet, I am in violation of the TOS for the usage I described above, and should expect my RingPlus account to be terminated forthwith as descrived in the TOS.

      How am I and others like me "justifying cheating" ?????

      Delete
    5. "How am I and others like me "justifying cheating"

      You're not-read again I have a feeling that was in reference to the 7 phones person.

      Delete
    6. As others have said, 1 free line and as many paid lines as you like. Although a point made in one of the forums raises the question as to where the 1 free line restriction can be found. I checked the TOS, FAQs, and other places and have yet to find it. Personally I don't care if you have 1 free line or 100 free lines. If you aren't exceeding the limits for any of the lines, they should leave you alone. The red herring of fraud chasing is just that, a red herring. The bad side to this is how many innocents will get caught in the red herring trap. A couple of people on RP made the point about how easily it would be falsely caught. Having worked with stat and IT people, it's a lot easier to catch an innocent person than it is to catch a fraudulent account unless the fraud account is being exceptionally stupid.

      Delete
    7. Forum censorship has been an RP staple for years.

      Truth is offensive, and they police offensiveness, so it's really a matter of course that the community turned into a nuthouse.

      At least all those accusations of RP being a ponzi scheme turned out to be right, with RP outright publicizing their intent to slowly kick people off and steal their remaining balances.

      But if you tried posting something like that on RP's message board, they'd just call you a troll and delete your comment, all because your opinions aren't the right ones.

      And as a result, nobody else would be warned of the impending ripoff, even if it'd stop them from being suckered.

      It's actually a shame that in the 16th year of our new millennium, there are still people who believe that the best ideas come from moderated discussions.

      Let RP be a testament to how wrong they were, at least until the company (and all its dosh) mysteriously vanishes without a trace.

      Delete
  32. Ringplus created a successful money maker. Can't see them just throw it away because of some rule they came with when they panicked and some very nasty customers. Once things settle, it will all be ok.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. They're cashing out.

      Delete
    2. Dream on. As it stands, my friend filed an FCC complaint because those rules fly in the face of unlimited. He's not the first and won't be the last. Maybe if they hired a lawyer who had experience and hired people who understood FCC, FTC, DOJ, et al. are groups you need to avoid ticking off, I could agree with you. Alas, they haven't and don't appear to be ready to do so in the near future. I would join a class action, but the last few class actions had people winning $2 -50 and spending more time filling out paperwork than the pocketchange was worth.

      Delete
  33. Well hopefully M+ accounts are safe..... Unless R+ juat took that money for nothing appraoch as well.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Unless there's a specific exemption, the walls are closing in on absolutely everyone.

      You also have to worry about the ceiling slowly coming down on how much service you can use.

      It was a trap this entire time, and I'm just glad I got out before getting stuck in the pit with everyone else.

      Delete
  34. Stick a fork in RingPlus+ , She's done!

    Don't think for a moment any of you are getting your overage-$20 deposits back. Already spent, that's left the building too!

    ReplyDelete
  35. Offering the mad plans (direct Sprint) was basically ring plus admitting they couldn't fix their whole reason to exist (ring plus radio)?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. No, it was to generate additional revenue streams and to address lag issues for those willing to pay for no lag. If there is any issue with reason to exist, it's the offering unlimited plans for free and the outrageous free plans. They could offer 1,000 talk, text, and data for free which is twice what FP offers and do fine. At those levels, they would curb most abusers because it wouldn't be worth the cost to have enough free phones to game the system. Higher levels, 2 - 3 GB, would still be low enough to curb gaming. When you hit 5 - 8 GB, the number of phones needed to game the system becomes worthwhile enough to make it doable. Ten phones would give 50 - 80 GB and twenty would give 100 - 160 GB, more than enough for most abusers. Although the present $35 minimum Top-up requirement to get those plans would cost more than it's worth in the short run. Throw in how much you would need to buy phones on the cheaper sites and you spent more than it's worth in the mid-term. To get decent LTE phones, it would be more than it's worth in the long term. You have to factor in the other costs in addition to the ones I mentioned which most often forget or ignore. With 10 - 20 phones, those add up fast.

      Delete
  36. Cricket revised their TOS today.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Cricket TOS? Do tell!

      Delete
    2. Cricket changes TOS!!! That means Cricket will go out of business!!! Can you see that it is the end of the world?!???

      Delete
    3. What did Cricket change in theirs? Did they add clauses that say you are subject to termination if you talk or text more than the average customer?

      Delete
  37. The problem with the abuse angle is that any real abuse is not going to follow along the lines of the new rules. Abuse is going to come in the form of maxing out the allotment(s) and moving to another line, not using a simple 50%+1 over your current usage that spans over a 6 month period. That measure is so broad it sweeps up everyone and that is their intention. They are not accountable to anyone, so they can enforce these terms on anyone at anytime and they do not have to prove abuse to anyone but themselves.

    Their abuse angle is fraudulent!

    R+ customers really need to start filing FCC complaints over these rules, it is the only way to get the FCC to look at them.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/filing-informal-complaint

      Delete
    2. Good link. Filling it out now. The true fraud and abuse is a company setting limits and coming after you for staying within the limits. Unlimited, by definition, has no limits and going after those users targeted by RingPlus is a lawyer's dream job.

      Delete
  38. Has lawsuit and class action written all over it, and yes, I am ignoring Rule 24 which bars both actions because courts have no problem allowing both against companies that have similar clauses in their TOS.

    RP is also ignoring the feds attitude when it comes to plan offerings. If I have a plan with your company for 5000 TTD with minimal calling requirement (1/60 days), the feds expect I can use all or as much of each TTD as long as I meet the minimum. Also, unlimited has typically been considered unlimited so any unlimited plans, including the unlimited data plans or add-ons, means I can use unlimited data. Anything less on any of these counts is grounds for the feds to hit them with fines, etc. A point missed by the fanboys/girls and shills defending the plan.

    The claim by RP's CTO, and his defenders, about being a start-up stopped being valid a while back.

    Worse, for RP, the feds hate arbitrary, selective, or "at our discretion" enforcement. Needs to be an all or nothing enforcement to avoid additional lawsuits that would also add discrimination to the mix.

    As mentioned in this article, publish X, Y, and Z and if abuse continues, then add T, U, and V. If anything, RP set itself up for abuse by allowing unlimited anything. The ever increasing caps, with 8K TTD for one plan and numerous plans at 6K TTD, don't help. Find it funny somebody on the RP forum would claim a person with 10 - 20 phones was abusing the system. Based on how much it would cost them to Top-up so many phones, it wouldn't be worth it for most people.

    ReplyDelete
  39. What about lines that are "free" every month but only if you pay your member+ fee every month?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It applies to all free lines. In your case, if you stop paying your Member+ fee, you lose the plan if it has a requirement to be Member+. If that's not bad enough, they no longer offer monthly Member+ as an option.

      Delete
    2. When did RingPlus stop offering M+? I still see it available. Maybe M+ is gone on just your account?

      Delete
    3. They haven't stopped offering Member+. They have stopped offering the non Lifetime versions back in late July. You could do monthly @ $19.99, yearly @ $99.99, quarterly @ $59.99, or a 8-month Lifetime plan where you paid $19.99 for 8 months ($160ish as compared to $120 if you do the one-time payment and you had to choose the 8 month plan, not the regular monthly plan). If you are on one of the non-Lifetime plans, don't give it up because you won't get it back. The exception for giving one up would be the $99.99 plan which only made sense if you couldn't afford the extra $20 for Lifetime. I can't afford Lifetime or I would go for it. The perks outweigh the benefits even with the new TOS in place. They keep being asked to bring back the $40 Lifetime M+ that was offered briefly.

      Delete
  40. Saw in the other forum where their lawyer was hired right out of law school with no experience. That explains a lot. Better to hire a back-up legal eagle to proof your inexperienced lawyer's inexperience. Depending on which law school, it may be worse than imagined as some law schools adopted the "We don't fail anybody" philosophy which leads to people who shouldn't be lawyers. If a future lawyer wannabe can't handle the pressures of law school, he/she isn't going to handle the pressures of a courtroom against somebody who could fail in law school.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Never-mind the lawyer, they should hire a math teacher to proof-read their TOS, since somebody obviously doesn't know how those pesky percentages work...

      Delete
  41. That "50%" is obviously just a typo that should have been "150%" or perhaps "50% more". This is nothing unusual in the cellular world, where Verizon doesn't know the difference between decimals of a dollar and decimals of a cent, and so charges 100X as much as they advertise.

    All this anti-R+ back-biting is ridiculous. They've been around for several years, it's idiotic to claim they plan to dump all their users and close-up shop, over one typo in their TOS. The mismanagement of their forums is also a long tradition, so just don't use it.

    I'm happy with R+'s new "Mad" plans. Same service as Boost/Virgin but at ridiculously low prices if you wait for a double/cut promo. I still don't recommend R+ to most friends/family because it requires some level of technical knowledge and self-help, and waiting around for rotating promos, as well as Sprint's weak coverage. But saving $30/mo over Boost/Virgin for months now, I'm happy with them. No doubt Sprint will give users a few days to port-out their numbers if the worst should happen.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. They are phasing out the Double/Cut promos. Last one is running now. As to back-biting, far from it. Valid points have been raised and RP has not answered them, other than posting some drivel in a forum other than their own forum. A lot more than one typo. Legally, TOS are binding so they could axe everybody that violates 20 or 22. If they don't and go with selective termination, they risk being hit by (insert favorite/least favorite relevant federal alphabet soup agency here) jumping in and that's not pretty for the company. You can't offer X amount of Talk, Text, and Data and then dump people because you created a TOS that says you can. FTC, FCC, DOJ, etc. will be over that like a company's worst nightmare. Same goes for unlimited as the feds have been jumping companies for offering unlimited that wasn't unlimited. Maybe if RP hired a lawyer with experience dealing with the above fed agencies, they would know why it's a bad idea.

      Delete
    2. The more it changes the more it stays the same.

      No written exclusions, just empty assurances. You are still tied to 50% of any single billing period over 6 months. It still nullifies your ability to use your promised allotment. This just so much Bull Crap!

      Delete
    3. "No written exclusions, just empty assurances. You are still tied to 50% of any single billing period over 6 months. It still nullifies your ability to use your promised allotment. This just so much Bull Crap!"

      Pretty sure the FCC would disagree with this policy and if RP is unwise to test it, they will find out the hard way promising you get X amount of talk/text/data, but then getting busted for using it is not a way to make friends with the FCC. If I get busted by RP, I will be one of the ones filing a complaint. May still file an informal complaint to make them aware of RP's actions.

      Delete
  42. I'm leaving Ringplus for different reasons. Frequently, I can't place an outgoing call in strong coverage. At least once per day incoming callers hear a message that my number is not in service.

    I ported to RP. Does anyone know where you find your account number and password to port out? Thanks.

    If I were staying with RP, I would send a certified letter stating I don't agree to the new TOS

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Go to Account Settings, Port In/Out There's a port out option there; it's hard to spot as the main link is Port In. Upper right corner has Port Out Instructions. Click on it and it shows your phone number, billing address, and PIN.

      You will lose your Top-up balance. Switching to a Mad plan may resolve your calling problems based on others who use Mad vs. non-Mad plans. Mad Scientist is cut in half temporarily and looks like one of the Mad plans will win the last Double or Cut promo. Mad BBQ (1-4 lines) is available with decreasing prices for the 2-4 lines.

      If you stayed with RP, your certified letter is meaningless. By staying with them, you agreed to their new TOS. Don't know why people think they can dictate a company's TOS, but you can't. Worst case scenario, you hire a lawyer or file a complaint with the appropriate state and federal regulatory or legal watchdogs. Sending your certified letter is grounds for RP to terminate your service because you specifically tell them you don't agree and from a legal perspective, they would have the right to terminate your service because you didn't agree to the TOS.

      Delete
    2. they cannot have terms and conditions of their imagination.

      Delete
  43. It's pretty funny, Karl has addressed the new TOS on the forum and the regular shills are stumbling over themselves to kiss his feet.
    Sorry but I don't trust a thing Mgmt. at R+ says.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. He also replied on HOFO - but in terms of Rule 20, for instance, it still makes no sense.

      He didn't dispute the "50% of any one prior month within the last 6" wording - only focused on how this was somehow to be applied to FUTURE plans/members.
      Um. Not buying it:
      If it's for future members, state "This rule will apply only to accounts acquired on or after MM/DD/YY."

      Further, even if this were so, those FUTURE members would still be unable to use the allotment they signed up for each month, given the wording. Using only 300TTD/1000TTD doesn't make anyone an abuser of service anymore than a person using 1000/5000. If I sign up for a plan offering me 1000TTD, I should be able to use as much or as little of that as I please, provided I am abiding by whatever minimum usage mark a company wants to set.

      And before anyone says it's free - yes, monthly, it is free for many people (ignoring the top up balances). However, if you have one of the paid plans, R+ makes no distinction in its TOS for those. All are painted with the same broad, illogical brush. So, you pay for your service every month - but according to the TOS, you are only able to use a portion of it.

      The fact that the wording itself was not disavowed or called a typo or whatever by Karl himself should give everyone pause. Very glad that although I like the service, I do not have my main phone number there.

      Delete
    2. Karl's become the messiah of people who barely use their phones, but he's actually the Ring+leader of a prepaid circus slash ponzi scheme.

      He even approved a TOS that outlaws legitimate usage, especially when it falls within the confines of a plan's clearly stated limits.

      The irony is, I used to think RP was pretty decent.

      But then they cracked down on criticism, deleted plan comparisons, stripped away data addons and failed to compensate for FEDmageddon.

      And thanks to their pro-censorship, "no meanies allowed" moderation policies, anyone trying to tell them the harsh truths about their failures would either get ignored or silenced.

      At that point, I saw the iceberg coming and jumped ship.

      Now RP's sunk to the levels of being a complete scam, raking in top-ups and M+ fees from people whom they can kick off on a whim, all for supposedly free service on a network so shitty it sure as heck doesn't warrant the cost or complexity.

      At a glance, it also seems like the only people left in the RP community are reluctant folks shouting down critics with the stock slogan "NOT MUH KARL," or fiscally loose cucks who're too enamored with the company to ever realize its real costs and failings.

      Maybe next month the Church of Karl can even apply for tax-free status.

      After all, they do have their own set of devout followers, who consider him their God.

      Delete
    3. Way to go Karl: "so-called unlimited" doesn't exist. If you are offering something called unlimited, then it better be unlimited or I will max out the unlimited enough to be targeted by your shills and then file complaints with the FTC, FCC, SEC, the Attorneys-General of the U.S., California, and my home state for fraud, misrepresentation, and every other thing my law firm tells me I can and file an individual and class-action against your company showing how meaningless General Rule 24 is. Pretty sure enough members of this forum, SD, FW and HoFo are more than willing to join it.

      Delete
  44. I'll start to believe it when reports of normal non-abusive users getting dropped starts happening. I don't think it will happen, but we shall see. Like many others, I've been using this to save lots of money on airtime this past year, but being sprint based, it could never be my only phone, so I've always had a backup on a network with "reasonable boonies coverage" which in the West, excludes both Sprint and Tmobile. Maybe someday those coverage gaps will go away, but until then, and for safety, I can't risk primary service on these networks.

    ReplyDelete
  45. Anyone see the statement in the TOS that says you agree to not do a"chargeback" is that even legal?

    ReplyDelete
  46. Props to Dennis for alerting us to this travesty of a TOS. In the near term, I will send several sternly written notices to R+ management and their board of directors urging them to amend the TOS. I will post any replies I receive.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Don't bother.

      The only language a business understands is the loss of customers and money.

      The only thing you can do that'llmatter worth a damn is cancelling all your lines and never doing business with them again.

      Delete
    2. @Anonymous, they also understand lawsuits and class actions, and letters from fancy law firms if you know any. My brother-in-law won't represent me, but he does have a high dollar firm that will. It cost him over a mil to buy into the firm and he did it before he was 30. He wasn't from a wealthy family, the money was from all the cases he won.

      Delete
    3. If your brother-in-law, who made millions before age 30, will not represent you, then I think that speaks for itself. :)

      Delete
    4. A modified,but still clumsily worded TOS was released dated Sept 12. I view this as evidence of responsiveness towards consumer input, and will maintain my service as the TOS has been amended in an adequate manner.

      Delete
  47. All of the talk of lawsuits is crazy. A lawsuit is to recoup losses. The first thing you have to do for it to be successful is show a loss. Does anyone have a loss large enough to interest a lawyer and make it worth pursuing for 30%?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. 30% of free. Maybe an unemployed lawyer looking for work experience. haha

      Delete
    2. People are all talk and no action.

      Instead of cancelling their lines and abandoning RP, they're just spouting a lot of BS while not doing a damn thing that really matters.

      At the end of the day, anyone still using RP has no right to complain.

      Delete
    3. Does not keep someone from filing an FCC complaint over the ambiguous TOS and the subsequent conflicting public statements and letting the FCC weigh in on those, does it!

      The sooner users or even potential users file complaints with the FCC over the conflicting public statements and the binding Terms of Service the sooner the FCC will weigh in.
      Let Jerry_GC take on the FCC.

      Delete
    4. Class actions and individual lawsuits can include damages, punitive and real, which can lead to big bucks. For class actions, the big bucks goes to the law firm and for individual lawsuits, you get to keep 1/2 to 2/3 usually.

      Delete
    5. That is true, it is very apparent that some of the members are mentally impaired, so that can be added to the lawsuit. One time top up for free service... hello, McFly?

      Delete
  48. If only one word is added to Rule 20 so that it reads as "If your talk, text or data usage INCREASE exceeds 50% of your total voice, text or data usage for any prior billing cycle in the immediately prior 6 months, RingPlus may, in its sole discretion and without notice, expire, suspend, terminate or downgrade your Service", it would actually make perfect sense.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It makes no sense at all. Why can't I increase my usage as needed if I stay within limits of OFFERED and AGREED cap for which I PAID.
      Or you are OK with the situation when you get a 12 pack but can have only one can a day? Or if you had 2 cans make sure not to have 4 next time when you get another 12 pack?

      Delete
    2. Looks like that was changed to say "exceeds", so it now matches what you are asking for here...

      Delete
    3. "It makes no sense at all. Why can't I increase my usage as needed if I stay within limits of OFFERED and AGREED cap for which I PAID."

      Every RP customer in their right mind's already set sail for better service.

      The only ones left have no idea what the hell they're talking about.

      They're all nuts, from the top down.

      You can tell by RP's lack of GSM service, which any reasonable Sprint MVNO and any serious prepaid customer would've been clamoring for after FEDmageddon.

      As of now, there's just no way to defend the current state of RP, at least not unless you're a casual customer with a 1GB burner that rarely sees any use.

      Delete
  49. Just more Lip Service as the terms are basically the same crap that still sweep up everyone and can be arbitrarily applied with no accountability.
    The EC angle is a facade, it is a kangaroo court made up of the same R+ employee(s),Jerry Mowrey being the principle, who wrote the crap to begin with and a select few of R+ steadfast sycophants. Hardly an ethical standard to go by.

    Both the volunteer EC and Mods are elected by a significant minority of R+ users and they even vote amongst themselves for their positions. The were elected on a margin of about 50 votes total and that is probably exaggerated.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It appears that every registered member can vote for Ethical Committee and Moderator positions, and that RingPlus has always accepted whoever has won the popular membership vote, entirely without objection. I imagine you are right that only a minority of members vote, but every member is entitled to vote. Seems pretty fair to me. Can you name another carrier that allows members to help decide such matters? If so, please provide a list.

      Delete
    2. Ring Plus vets every EC and Mod. Show me one Mod or EC member that is not a fawning parasite.

      Delete
    3. The voting was very fairly done, anyone could participate, and as it turned out, those most knowledgeable and with the best judgement cast those votes.

      Anyway, RingPlus got this whole thing cleared up. The new TOS rules for future unlimited plans. Nothing has changed. Everybody was in an uproar over NOTHING! LOL

      Delete
    4. "The voting was very fairly done"

      "those most knowledgeable and with the best judgement cast those votes"

      You're shilling pretty hard, my friend.

      Delete
    5. re: "The voting was very fairly done"
      You must be joking. This is the worst group of mod/ec volunteers I have seen in any public forum. They act like a bunch of 5th grade girls. No one voted because the vote was seen by everyone...why do you think the voter turnout was so low? The only votes cast were by the mods and they all voted for each other. Their experience if you call it that was comparable to that of someone in elementary school. We now see the outcome of these shills....the forum is cascading into a downward spiral and very few users including many long term customers avoid the mess that these moderators have created. They call names, they delete posts of people that challenge R+ to be better--it's a bunch of shills in disguise as members. And NO--R+ did not get the whole thing cleaned up, it's still as big a mess as it was 3 days ago.

      Delete
    6. The rules for member EC and Mod elections do allow RingPlus to vet the nominees-- but no elected member has ever been declined or disqualified by RP. Since any member in good standing can run, and every member can vote, it appears that the members prefer to choose those you describe as "fawning parasites" to represent them rather than choosing paranoid, rumor-mongering jerks.

      Delete
    7. My guess is a few of the posts are accurate about the ec/mod folks. I hear most are in the teenager bracket, unemployed and living in the parents basement. They frequently talk about video games and Pokemon Go, what working ADULTS have time for that. I have also heard that the screen names are all fake and that RP has it's own people log in under the moderator names to clean up the forum. That explains why some of the ec/mods are online 24 hours a day. Your guess is as good as mine although the truth is "parasite" is probably an accurate description.

      Delete
    8. I'm amazed that anyone expects to find uncensored criticism of a company's product on a forum run by that company.

      The TracFone, Sprint, T-Mobile, FreedomPop, Verizon and every other company hosted forum are all the same, heavily moderated to show the company and its products in its best light.

      The only thing the RingPlus forum is good for is finding out when the next promo starts.

      Delete
    9. Anyway, RingPlus got this whole thing cleared up. The new TOS rules for future unlimited plans. Nothing has changed. Everybody was in an uproar over NOTHING! LOL

      If true, it's still illegal. You can't place these types of limits on plans and call them unlimited. Also, if true, why did Jerry's example include a limited plan? The one he renamed Zeebra.

      Delete
  50. Just wanted to add my voice. My savings since moving from Verizon to Ring+ last year for my wife and I has passed $1000 now. It's been a great move. I suggest whiners just stick with what they have.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. But according to "what we have", RingPlus can terminate anyone.

      Delete
    2. Your suggestion is noted and taken, my friend.

      Delete
  51. Thanks, Dennis, good article! Though it's dismaying and bewildering news.
    I for one am thankful to Ring+ for their service. I probably wouldn't have had phone service if not for them. I was on FreedomPop and Assurance Wireless's Lifeline program. If I have to go back, fine. Fp does now have GSM service. Failing that what do I need internet for anyway?! Or maybe I'll go to the coffee shop more. Hey, I'll get more exercise from the walking there more.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Probably one of the very few posts here that actually make sense.

      Delete
    2. "Probably one of the very few posts here that actually make sense."

      Providing you live in an area with a coffee shop around every corner.

      Otherwise, his post makes a few too many assumptions about other potential, current and former RP customers.

      Delete
  52. I just realized that our family has had RingPlus phones since 2013. There have been a few hiccups here and there and I wouldn't recommend them to anyone not willing to do their research, but the service has been great overall. The RingPlus users in my family have cumulatively saved thousands over the past three years. We'll stick with them while keeping our eyes wide open.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Like me, I wouldn't try this service unless I had no other choice. There's a point in which you have to choose how much hassle you are willing to put up with in order to get a discounted/free service. I'm not willing to do that.

      Delete
  53. Looking in from the outside the corporate structure appears to be:
    1) CEO= Parent 1 CTO=Parent 2
    2) Billing, Support, Marketing = Teens of parent 1 & parent 2
    3) Moderators = Children of the teens from support & billing.
    The rough draft of the recent TOS was written in crayon.

    ReplyDelete
  54. I understand why the shills and fanboys/girls have to kiss up. When you are getting something for free or almost free, you have to show some loyalty and say it's dark even when the sun's brightness is blinding your eyes.

    ReplyDelete
  55. I didnt vote but i lol when one of the actve poster "rosco" voted for 2 EC members that were unknown and voted for only 2 mods. Was "rosco" banned?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. So you criticize a person voting for two candidates that they wanted?
      Why would you vote for more if you only thought 2 were qualified? The whole bunch that currently run the forum are los*rs,
      perhaps on the next vote a few more people with some common sense will vote!

      Delete
    2. Surely the People's Republic of Ring Plus wouldn't ban people for voting the wrong way.

      Delete
    3. I still see posts from rosco once in a while, so I don't think so.

      Delete
  56. "I didnt vote but i lol when"
    Why are you whining if you didn't vote? SMH

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Chill.dumb 2 vote 4 a few members only. These minions have power to ban u. Vote 4 every1 or no1. Peace out

      Delete
    2. Anonymous voting is the only way to vote, home slice.

      Delete
  57. It's updated again. In trying to be positive, it sounds like they are trying to enter the world of saying something is unlimited when it actually isn't. And in typical RingPlus fashion, making a confusing mess of it, communicating poorly,then making it even more complicated as a "fix" after their community shrieks in agony/delight for the better part of a week.

    ReplyDelete
  58. I got the dreaded 60 days with no calls notice today and they automatically suspended my account, no warning, just did it and forced me to have to pick a new plan (granted only had to pay the $15 activation and it was close to my original plan).

    I'm not one to use a cell for much since I prefer Google Voice and can text thru a web browser that way. I don't go overboard with data usage - never over 500MB on a plan that allowed 2500MB, usually not even 100MB used. Definitely annoying they would auto suspend/cancel plan when I'm in no way "abusing" their service. I wanted a smartphone for the convenience but rarely use for calls and pretty much never text with the phone.

    I'd still say the service has more than met my needs in the 9 months I've had it and is a great bargain. But that's a pretty crappy way to handle the customer service side on something like this. Indeed, the clock may be ticking on the company's existence. I'll probably ride it out until then or the next idiotic move like this one, whichever comes first.

    ReplyDelete
  59. RingPlus has been doing mass censoring on their forums. Anything you say negative is censored. The mods and their so called ethical committee are all paid by RingPlus a compensation, so you cannot trust anything they say.

    It is best to find another mvno in my opinion. Their annoucement shows just how much crap the company is.

    ReplyDelete
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